READERS - DUMP YOUR BAILOUT THOUGHTS HERE PDF Print E-mail
Written by Stumo   
Friday, 26 September 2008

 We've been getting more comments here.  I'm going to try something new for this site, starting a discussion thread on the financial bailout.  I've been commenting on the plans, but have no real solution. 

TAKE JUST A MOMENT TO COMMENT - Here are the topics as a guide.  But if you want to talk about your dog, I can't stop you.

1.  Whether a bailout should occur; and

2.  If so, what should it look like.

The Washington Post has presented non-Wall Street economists' views on the matter.

Krugman makes some decent points.   Some action is necessary.  The original Paulson plan was questionable and the plan apparently agreed to later seemed a lot better. 

Well, the bipartisan “agreement on principles” released on Thursday looks a lot better than the original Paulson plan. In fact, it puts Mr. Paulson himself under much-needed adult supervision, calling for an oversight board “with cease and desist authority.” It also limits Mr. Paulson’s allowance: he only (only!) gets to use $250 billion right away.

Meanwhile, the agreement calls for limits on executive pay at firms that get federal money. Most important, it “requires that any transaction include equity sharing.”

Of course there was a blow up and there is no plan now. 

Thomas Palley says the underlying economy must be included in the discussion:

It is no good fixing the supply of finance if there is no demand for finance or if the demand for finance is based on rotten foundations. That is why helping Main Street is as essential as bailing out the banks.

John Paulson says the U.S. should receive preferred stock in return for  taxpayer money.

 

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Our Country has just been raped.
written by Natalie Tschiedel , October 03, 2008
Our elected representatives who claim to represent their constituents have just participated in the rape of the century. If you watched the Rules Committee's response on Thursday as they were asked to seek other options, before voting for the Bailout bill, it was outrageous to hear how they were unwilling to seek other options from unbiased exports in order to make a better decision. The whole Congress should have been outraged at the increase of $150 billion more for "pork". We need to ask these same "caring" politicians about giving up their excellent health insurance plans, paid by us, and to change to Social Security for their retirement plans, instead of the exceptional retirement plans that only elected officials have. I'm willing to bet one month of my SS income that we might catch their attention.
Also, I encourage all of you, to stop buying imports. Unless it is an emergency, buy only American made products, including the food that you eat. You can do it!
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No on the Bailout
written by Vicky Davis , October 03, 2008
The bailout won't fix the problem because it doesn't address the structural problems in our economy. Until those structural problems are corrected, it doesn't matter how much money Congress votes to stimulate the economy and bailout Wall Street, our country will continue on the slide to the third world.

The structural problems in the economy are due to those fraudulent 'free trade' agreements that allow our markets - goods and SERVICES (people) to be flooded with cheap imports. Our economy is collapsing because we can't compete with cheap labor and still maintain a first world economy.

Globalization has allowed the concentration of wealth leading to monopolies of both the economic and political system by a tiny minority of people. This direction has to be reversed - meaning we need protection for our markets - both goods and labor. So when somebody accuses you of being a protectionist... say, Hell Yeah! And I'm proud of it!
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Constitutional issues part 2 link
written by Theresa Nielsen , September 27, 2008
http://www.wethepeoplefoundati...-24-08.pdf
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Constitutional issues and law to consider....................
written by Theresa Nielsen , September 27, 2008
Did our founding fathers intend to create a system to fund private companies with tax payers money? hmm What Constitutional authority exists for the U.S. Government or Federal Reserve to use public (taxpayer) funds for definitively private purposes? I say America Wake up already take your pulse.
1. The unauthorized use of
taxpayer funds infringes upon Plaintiff’s individual, unalienable Right to Liberty and Property.
2. No more free lunches for private entities & foreign powers,
http://www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/PROJECTS/AIG/Bailout-Brief-Suppt-TRO-9-24-08.pdf

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written by Paul Muegge , September 27, 2008
Certainly actions will be taken,but why the rush to address a very serious falacy that we have witnessed for years. The Wall Street gang need to accept the realities of their accesses. If a bailout and that is what it should be labeled happens will they have learned what has caused the mess? Those who drove the truck down this road to ruin need to be required adhere to some basic rules of the road. I recall that during the crash of the eighties those of us in agriculture were told that we failed because we were poor managers and bankers who also failed were only victims of poor timing.
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written by bob johns , September 26, 2008
There is plenty of blame to go around and many of us have been sounding the alarm for quite a while. The consumer acts as irresponsibly as the government in his spending habits. As a country and a people, we have bought much more than we can pay for. Like the addict we borrow from abroad to finance our largess. Enter stage left an inane trade policy that has perpetuated since Clinton. In recent years the result is another $6.5 trillion in foreign debt. Our stupid approach to trade has eliminated almost 4 million good jobs in the manufacturing sector alone (remember, the manufacturing sector genetates almost 4 related service/support jobs and is THE major consumer of technology in this country) and replaced them with lower income jobs. So, we place another $700 billion on the backs of the 70% of Americans who pay the taxes as their wages stagnate? We have damaged our ability to make things and feed ourselves, do our own research/product development, provide meanigful employment to the majority of the population that cannot attend college. Our best and brightest come out of college to go to (gag) Wall Street? Wow. Every congress since 1992 has booted the issues in one way or another and the Bush Administration has put the icing on the arsenic laced cake. Time for a major overhaul in "leadership?" The two parties don't get it but thank God for the dissidents in both. Perhaps there will be a third way that represents the American people? Let us pray. And, vote.
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President
written by Linda Heft , September 26, 2008
I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT 700 BILLON DOLLARS IN INTERNAL U.S. CURENCY IS ABOUT TO DESTROY THE AMERICAN FINANCIAL SYSTEM. 700 BILLION IS THE SAME AMOUNT THAT WE BORROW FROM FOREIGNERS EVERY YEAR TO FINANCE OUR TRADE DEFICIT. IT IS THAT CUMULATIVE TRADE DEFICIT THAT IS SINKING US. 3 TRILLION US DOLLARS IS HELD BY CHINA, JAPAN, AND THE UK. THE AMERICAN DOLLAR IS LOSING VALUE EVERY DAY. INSTEAD OF BUYING AMEIRCAN GOODS, OF WHICH THERE IS LESS AND LESS EACH YEAR. THAT'S THE REASON FOR THE LACK OF INCOME IN THE REAL ECONOMY - THAT DAVE ANDRETSON TALKS ABOUT. THINK OF THE CATASTROPHE RESULTING FROM OUR CREDITORS TAKING THEIR DOLLARS OUT OF OUR T-BILLS AND DUMPING ALL THOSE DOLLARS ON THE INTERNATIONAL SYSTEM.

PRINTING UP AN INFLATIONARY 700 BILLION AND SOLVING THE FINANCIAL "CRISIS" IS SMALL POTATOES COMPARED TO WHAT'S COMING DOWN THE PIKE.

EVEN THE 700 BILLION FIGURE IS OVERSTATED BECAUSE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT MORTGAGES ON ABOUT 5 MILLION HOMES, AND SURELY THESE MORTGAGES HAVE SOME DEGREE OF PAID-OFF EQUITY WHICH WOULD ALLOW THE MORTGAGE HOLDERS TO LOW-PRICE THESE HOMES WITHOUT TAKING TOO MUCH OF A LOSS. THEY CERTAINLY SHOULD TAKE FULL LOSS SHORT OF BANKRUPTCY BEFORE WE TAXPAYERS GIVE THEM ANY HELP.
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"No" to bailout
written by Patrick Wood , September 26, 2008
Government intervention is socialism at its best. The global bankers privatize 100% of their profits, and they think they can socialize their losses. Not. Of course they will try if they think there is even a ghost of a chance to sucker us into it. I say we fire both Paulson and Bernanke for gross mismanagement and let the rest of their banker buddies sweat it out like we must. As taxpayers, we should insist on the Treasury divesting itself of AIG, Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac. We do not (quite) yet live in a socialist society, and I say keep it that way. We do not want a centralized government owning all of this stuff -- it will breed only additional corruption, favoritism and market dysfunction.
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written by David Anderson , September 26, 2008
There is no value in saying "I told you so." It is, however, essential that actions address the true "root cause," which is lack of income in the "real economy." So far, no one in position to act - neither Jason Furman nor Douglas Holtz-Aiken on NPR's Morning Edition, nor legislators - have acknowledged the need to do something other than let those being foreclosed receive and opportunity to renegotiate mortgage terms. What people need is the opportunity to have a better, income-generating, benefits accruing, tax-paying job. These opportunities must stimulate domestic production in order to have long-term economic effects that I believe we all intend.
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In the news

The following article appeared on the online site for Manufacturing & Technology News on November 17, 2008 and was written by Paul Craig Roberts, former Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan administration. 

By most accounts the U.S. economy is in serious trouble. Robert Reich, an adviser to President-elect Obama, calls it a "mini-depression," but that designation might be optimistic. Russian economist Mikhail Khazin says that the "U.S. will soon face a second Great Depression." It is possible that even Khazin is optimistic.

I cannot predict the future. However, I can explain what the problems are, how they differ from past times of troubles and why traditional remedies, such as the public works programs that Reich proposes, are unlikely to succeed in reviving the U.S. economy.

Read more...